How many Israelis were killed on October 7, again? And, how many were children?
*Caveat: this article is based on information that may change as more becomes available.
Duper’s delight: Look at that smug smile – Benjamin Netanyahu may have been telling fibs again.
It seems Israel may have been lying to us all (surprise, surprise!) about what happened on October 7 – the number of civilian fatalities, the number that were children, and what happened to them.
The following material comes from a website called The Cradle, which suggests that “evidence is now emerging that up to half the Israelis killed were combatants; that Israeli forces were responsible for some of their own civilian deaths [we knew that, right?]; and that Tel Aviv disseminated false ‘Hamas atrocities’ stories to justify its devastating air assault on Palestinian civilians in Gaza.”
It claims that information from the Israeli news organisation Haaretz showed that, by October 23, only 683 Israeli deaths could be verified – not the 1,400 claimed by Israel’s government:
Of these, 331 casualties – or 48.4 percent – have been confirmed to be soldiers and police officers, many of them female. Another 13 are described as rescue service members, and the remaining 339 are ostensibly considered to be civilians.
There are also so far no recorded deaths of children under the age of three, which throws into question the Israeli narrative that babies were targeted by Palestinian resistance fighters. Of the 683 total casualties reported thus far, seven were between the ages of 4 and 7, and nine between the ages of 10 and 17. The remaining 667 casualties appear to be adults.
So what about all those gruesome claims? Rapes, beheaded babies?
Aviva Klompas, a former speechwriter for the Israeli mission to the UN, was the first Israeli of note to spread the claim that there were reports of “Israeli girls being raped and their bodies dragged through the street.”
She posted this on X at 9:18 PM (Palestine time), on 7 October, although an op-ed Klompa published with Newsweek at 12:28 AM (Palestine time), on 8 October, made no mention of any sexual violence.
Klompas is also the co-founder of Boundless Israel, a “think-action tank” that works “to revitalize Israel education and take bold collective action to combat Jew-hatred.” An “unapologetically Zionist” charitable group that works to promote Israeli narratives on social media.
The one case touted as proof of rape was that of a young German-Israeli woman named Shani Louk, who was filmed face down in the back of a pickup truck and was widely assumed dead.
It was unclear whether the fighters filmed with Louk in the Gaza-bound vehicle were members of Hamas, as they do not sport the uniforms or insignia of the Al-Qassam troops identifiable in other Hamas videos – some even wore casual civilian clothing and sandals.
Later, her mother claimed to have evidence that her daughter was still alive, but had suffered a severe head wound. This rings true with information released by Hamas that indicated Louk was being treated for her injuries at an unspecified Gaza hospital.
Complicating matters further, on the day these rape allegations arose, Israelis would not have had access to this information. Their armed forces had not yet entered many, if not most, of the areas liberated by the resistance and were still engaged in armed clashes with them on multiple fronts.
Nevertheless, these rape claims took on a life of their own, with even US President Joe Biden alleging, during a speech days later, that Israeli women were “raped, assaulted, paraded as trophies” by Hamas fighters. It is important to note that The Forward’s article on 11 October reported that the Israeli military acknowledged they had no evidence of such allegations at that point.
When the army later made its own allegations of decapitations, foot amputations, and rape, Reuters pointed out that “the military personnel overseeing the identification process didn’t present any forensic evidence in the form of pictures or medical records.” To date, there is no credible evidence of these atrocities that has been presented.
Other outrageous allegations, such as the story of Hamas “beheading 40 babies‘ made headlines and the front pages of countless western news outlets. Even Biden claimed to have seen “confirmed photos of terrorists beheading babies.” The claims trace back to Israeli reserve settler and soldier David Ben Zion, who has previously incited violent riots against Palestinians and called for the West Bank town of Huwara to be wiped out. No evidence was ever produced to support these claims and the White House itself confirmed later that Joe Biden had never seen such photos.
What do you think?
We have first-hand information from former Hamas hostages that they have been well-treated. It seems that, besides the destruction of the IDF’s Gaza Division, the aim of the Hamas incursion on October 7 was to take live hostages that could be exchanged with the circa-5,300 Palestinians said to be inhabiting Israeli jails for no good reason, many of them women and children.
If that’s true, then Hamas would have wanted to avoid causing serious harm to civilians.
So – if this information is accurate, then Israel’s spokespeople have lied about the number and nature of the people who were killed, and in their claims of atrocities inflicted upon the dead.
Considering how other claims by Israel’s government have also fallen apart (which one is your favourite?)…
Well, what do you think? Comment using the box below.
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BBC report – “After a mauling by Israeli journalists on Saturday night, who interrogated him over his responsibility for the October 7th attacks and divisions in the war cabinet, this time Netanyahu took no questions. ”
– Could his “taking no questions” be because the truth is finally unravelling and not looking good for him ?
Keep up the pressure Mike…. the Truth will out !
Interesting revision and more likely to be nearer to the truth than not as the original figures came from Israeli sources and if I remember correctly the initial figure which was quickly disseminated around the world was 600 Israeli dead. Then it began to be amended upwards. Israel is not a credible source of factual information or news when it comes to the Palestinian conflict. Their military and diplomatic service and all its other institutions propagate all over the world a vision of themselves which is at odds with reality. As we so with the election of Jeremy Corbyn they and their allies in the media (with their own purposes in mind) conspired to destroy a political project with millions of people behind it and eventually topple it leading to its right wing capture. It is not just Israel, a country after all with less than ten million people, with more than a million Palestinians living there, but its super backer in the West, America, which has a declared agenda of its own in the Middle East and near beyond who are the real power behind the Israeli throne. Where there are lies there lies America, heir of Germany’s propaganda service. Nazi Germany was the full heir of the British Empire. Without that empire there would have been no holocaust. We owe a debt to the world to dissolve the British State, another giant interferer in the politics and social affairs of every nation on earth, and rid the world too of the US regime.
The remaining 339 are ostensibly considered to be civilians’. or are they settlers? i.e. living in occupied land.
A similar report came a few days ago https://x.com/propandco/status/1718092723750899809?s=20
I’ve asked Full Fact, C4News and a BBC contact (who apparently links to BBC Verify) if they can verify. So far only Full Fact with a polite response. They are inundated so it’s in a queue.
The only people who know what is really happening are those who live in Gaza and Israel. The propaganda used in War is intended to incite hatred and anger, so soldiers will fight fiercely and politicians will defend them. This has been the way of war over many centuries.
The truth takes much longer to come through the communication process and sadly history is often written by the victors not the losers . We study history to learn of the past but it doesn’t seem that lesson are learnt.
My view is Israel’s political and military leaders are very dangerous and incite racial hatred and discrimination in the name of religion.
I listened Radio 4’s Question Time on Saturday 28/10 with disgust, as one tory MP ranted on about the alleged atrocities committed by Hamas. He cited the beheading of babies, for which there is no evidence, and the rape of women, for which there is no evidence. I am disgusted that a politician from the UK should be spreading these unproven allegations, while totally ignoring the last 10 years of Palestinian oppression by Israel. And guess what? No-one on the panel refuted the claims. A woman in the audience tried to do so but was shut down. Representations of the war in Gaza are totally biased.
Important, needs people to know about this, Israeli IDF instructed to kill their own as well as Palestinians on October the 7th. https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/1718308008713650412