Jeremy Hunt responds to Little’s lesson on mental health – but is he credible?
The current debate started when the health secretary failed to respond positively after Professor Stephen Hawking challenged him to a live television debate.
The issue then was Professor Hawking’s claim that Mr Hunt cherry-picked statistics to suit his narrative – for example, with his claim that a “weekend effect” caused an increase in the number of NHS patient deaths. This claim was subsequently proved false.
So actor Ralf Little took up the baton, offering to debate Mr Hunt on television, in place of Professor Hawking, and claiming that Mr Hunt had “knowingly lied” when he said he had overseen the “biggest expansion of mental health provision in Europe”.
It seems Mr Hunt has chosen to respond to Mr Little – not by accepting the challenge, but in kind – with a lengthy Twitter thread in which he quotes statistics (selectively?) in support of his claims.
It is more than a week since Mr Little posted his own thread. Why the delay? Was Mr Hunt waiting for his aides to come up with statistics that would support him? In that case, he’ll be guilty of cherry-picking again.
Let’s have a quick reminder of Mr Hunt’s record as health secretary, with this infographic from the end of last year:
And, has he convinced anyone with his current argument?
Let’s consider what he has to say (with some tweet-specific replies thrown in – and I apologise for the repetition of some tweets; Mr Hunt has a very strange way of constructing his thread):
2) Now I know you are a funny bloke and in politics a lot of insults are traded but the question is can you back up what is a very strong claim?
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
Notice that Mr Hunt begins by setting out the claim, then goes straight into a put-down. Ralf Little has acted in comedy, certainly – that doesn’t make him a “funny bloke” and if he chooses to tackle a serious subject then he deserves to be treated seriously. And Mr Little did not trade any insults – he made an assertion and provided factual information to support it.
3) Parity of esteem for mental health became law in 2012, so here are the tables that show the 4,300 increase in staff at mental health trusts since 2013…
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
Id like to know where the 4,300 staff are hiding as i cant locate them when i need them.
— jonie1303 #NHSLove💙 #corbynwasright #gtto (@jonie1303) November 20, 2017
An increase in staff is not necessarily an increase in doctors and nurses, though.
4) ….more than 2,000 of which are fully qualified (e.g. not the reduction of 167 in the fullfact piece you linked). https://t.co/pS5O3j8Qq1
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
So, even if we take Mr Hunt’s word on the numbers, less than half these new staff are fully-qualified – and qualified in what, exactly? Mr Hunt says nothing to suggest that they are qualified medical practitioners specialising in mental health care.
6) …The data we have takes us from 2012 https://t.co/CKlDfaCcPv to 2015 https://t.co/zrmEERtaAs
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
Mental Health like vases has nothing to do with Midstaffs
— JBK#LoveNHS (@Tingletoot68) November 20, 2017
9) So to fill the gap we now have 8,000 MH nurses in training and have this Sept announced an increase in nurse training places overall by 25% https://t.co/6FZIAW0Rw8
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
Nurses in training do not equal an expansion in MH provision now – and an increase in nurse training places does not mean that candidates will step up to fill those places, especially as it now costs a considerable amount of money to train as a nurse.
10) You are correct that I did misread a briefing and tell the House of Commons that there was a 30,000 increase in mental health staff when I should have said a 30,000 increase in NHS clinical staff including in mental health…
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
However there is an 6-7k reduction in MH nurses working on the wards since 2010. 3,500 vacancies in midwifery with only an extra 104 taken on in 12mnths prior to 09/2016. Massive decline in student applications yet 25% more accepted with fewer qualified to teach.
— Ann Pendlebury🔶 (@1812ann) November 20, 2017
https://twitter.com/wendaville/status/932719930813894657
The NMC state that there are fewer.nurses joining the register than leaving.https://t.co/NOAAzutGAx pic.twitter.com/0TQeRhOU46
— Ann Pendlebury🔶 (@1812ann) November 20, 2017
12) But ‘more’ mental health staff does NOT mean ‘enough’ staff and still too many patients wait too long. That’s why we published plans in July for an additional 21,000 posts https://t.co/KmF2WPPSwm
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
21,000 posts? What kind of posts? And – let’s remember – plans do not always become reality.
Dear #JeremyHunt, in your tweet to @RalfLittle why did you not mention the falling number of psychiatrists to treat #ChildMentalHealth that has happened under your watch? https://t.co/kM6ETlgshw #NHS #MentalHealth
— Captain Starkiller (@cpnStarkiller) November 20, 2017
14) What about the dosh? Extra staff cost money so this is what the data shows last year alone spending on mental health went up by £575m https://t.co/oEzilsOTKQ
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
How do you know they aren’t spending that on themselves? There’s no accountability. Our local CCG overspent on themselves by £20mil for the past 5 years. Who monitors this? Who holds them accountable for keeping money for frontline services?? #SaveNascot #NHS @NHSEngland
— Angelina Murphy (@Angelina_SMurph) November 20, 2017
Well, not Croydon CCG! Been in special financial measures, cut funding from local services, including IAPT. It's a farce. All that talk about MH during the election hasn't shown itself at service delivery level in the borough.
— Sarah Strong (insta/bsky details in bio) (@Opiumia) November 20, 2017
Will you look into @SaveNHSNascot ?? @NHSEngland need to step up and hold the CCG to account. How long will innocent children and their families suffer. Unpaid carers are battling to save a 600k service coz HVCCG could not control their finances!!
— satnam kaur (@sat_k_j) November 20, 2017
CCG I worked for (retired 2014) spent less than national avge on MH as MH commissioner I was still expected to save £1million as part of QIPP. Glad I got out when I did after 37yrs as nurse & manager
— Helen #FBPE #Italy 🇮🇹🇪🇺💙 🇺🇦 (@fliss59) November 20, 2017
16) This has delivered some notable improvements in mental health in the last 7 years including the introduction of waiting times standards for psychosis and talking therapies for the first time anywhere in the world (with standards for eating disorders to follow)
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
Hang on – he states that spending went up last year, and this has delivered notable improvements in MH “in the last seven years”. How was this achieved? Time travel?
https://twitter.com/helenadurham/status/932690797081911296
17) The New York Times praised the expansion of talking therapies as “the world’s most ambitious effort to treat depression, anxiety and other common mental illnesses” https://t.co/U3ppmgFBRX
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
But more importantly the whole premise of the @nytimes article was that the NHS was going to move to treat 1 in 3 of the entire population. Which is wrong. The ambition is 1 in 3 of people affected with a #mentalhealth condition. I got the article corrected as attached. /2 pic.twitter.com/MeLX7TMvy6
— Luciana Berger (@lucianaberger) November 20, 2017
19) But there is still MUCH more to do. In fact we are only two years in to a five year plan that will see us treating a million more people by 2020/21 compared to when we started. Here’s the plan https://t.co/jgEpslR9AS
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
21) Perhaps you can see from the facts above why both I and the NHS England Chief Exec DO believe this is the biggest expansion of mental health provision in Europe… pic.twitter.com/HVOnkgYWZi
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
23) There may be a European country with bigger expansion plans but I have yet to find it. I am sure I don’t get everything right but on the basis of the evidence no reasonable person could describe the claim as “knowingly lying’
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
24) So let’s do a deal: you provide me with evidence that I was – as you claim – deliberately seeking to mislead the public about mental health in my Marr interview & I will happily meet you, factcheckers and all
— Jeremy Hunt (@Jeremy_Hunt) November 20, 2017
Let’s consider some of the general replies to Mr Hunt’s thread:
https://twitter.com/Daniellemalaur1/status/932620529693052928
https://twitter.com/David_Hesford/status/932671407623897089
https://twitter.com/tania_linden/status/932684574823415808
So what do you think? Is Mr Hunt credible?
I would suggest that he is not.
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i challenge jeremy hunt to come to acton west london were i live just stand with me on acton high street just for one hour and we can have a game of spot the mentaly ill ,yes jeremy it will be two hands in minnettes yes jeremy people with mental health problems who have been abandoned by you and your filthy tory government
I think Mr Littles statistics were more reliable than Mr Hunts whose figures seem to be based on 2012 data. Lots of things have changed in 5 years so it may be a case of trying to compare Apples to Pears. Hunt’s reference to Little being a funny bloke is a blatant Tory ruse to make the reader think that plebs are no nothings and that their comments are worthless compared to his. Arrogance is hardwired into people like Hunt and it rapidly comes to the fore as soon as a”bloke”, funny or not, challenges their view. Notice he never called Stephen Hawkins a “clever bloke” though.