Words of caution for ‘leftie’ voters: Stop sh*tting down European democracy!

Here’s a message for left-wing readers of This Site, from a social media colleague. I reproduce it without comment as I believe the message may be clear enough:

If you are a leftie and advocating voting Lib Dem or Brexit party you are SO WRONG! This has been getting me more and more angry over the last few weeks….


If you are a remainer, presumably that means you want to be part of the EU…..

If you’re a leaver, surely you want to leave a socialist Eu government in control there ?

Whichever is the case .. STOP S*****ING ON THEIR DEMOCRACY!!!!

There are countries in the EU who have proper SUFFERED under REAL FASCISM…. they actually fought to get SOCIALIST governments… countries like Spain and Portugal…
These elections aren’t about the UK, they’re about Europe….

We stand a good chance of having a socialist president in the Eu Parliament…. we want to see socialism rising across Europe to send a loud clear message to the right wing and neoliberals that ENOUGH is ENOUGH…..

And yet we care so LITTLE about the EU that we have socialists advocating turning their backs on fellow comrades in the fight for international socialism , and voting for right wing austerity enablers ….


if you don’t vote LABOUR in the Eu election you need a big long think about why you’re a leftie.

There’s a debate running about the message on Facebook, here.

Have YOU donated to my crowdfunding appeal, raising funds to fight false libel claims by TV celebrities who should know better? These court cases cost a lot of money so every penny will help ensure that wealth doesn’t beat justice.


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10 thoughts on “Words of caution for ‘leftie’ voters: Stop sh*tting down European democracy!

    1. Mike Sivier Post author

      Are they?
      Or have they been given bad advice, while being blocked from hearing anything better?

      1. Zippi

        Mike, only last week, you, yourself, suggested that people who voted to leave the E.U. were stupid. Furthermore, there is ample information that is freely available, from which people can draw their own conclusions.

      2. Mike Sivier Post author

        Did I suggest that people who voted to leave the EU were stupid? Context is everything so let’s have the link and the quote, please. Otherwise you must retract.

      3. Zippi


        “The people of the UK need to be aware that any hardship caused by Brexit has nothing to do with the spirit of World War Two.

        It has everything to do with the stupidity of people who were told they would be better off – and believed the lie.”

        That you disagree with people doesn’t make them, or what they did stupid. You don’t know what information these people used to draw their conclusions. “Better off” means different things to different people, also. Again, my recollection of the events of the Referendum Campaign is that was was offered was not certainty but possibility; nobody can say what the future holds. This is debatable but people drew their own conclusions. I cannot speak for others but I would not suggest that they were stupid. Gullible, perhaps but not stupid.

      4. Mike Sivier Post author

        Gullibility is a form of stupidity.

        You’re right – I don’t know what information those people used to draw their conclusions, because there were a lot of lies out there during the referendum campaign and the mainstream media failed utterly in their duty to fact check.

        “Better off” = “In a more desirable or advantageous position, especially in financial terms.” Impossible under any form of Brexit.

        Your recollection of the referendum campaign is after-the-event hedging. People voted in the firm belief that their choice was best. Many ‘Leave’ voters did so on the basis of the lie written on the side of that Brexit bus – a lie for which Boris Johnson is currently trying not to be taken to court.

        Have to admit I had forgotten that I had written that line in the Widdecombe story, but in context I’d say it is right. And your line about gullibility says you agree with me.

      5. Zippi

        No, Mike, I don’t agree with you. I don’t believe that people were stupid and wouldn’t call them that, because it is most disrespectful. As I said, “better off” means different things to different people and not necessarily financial. I don’t presume to know why people voted; I know why the people to whom I have spoken voted and most are not what could be described as stupid. What I don’t understand is the need to label people, to presume superiority, that, somehow, we know better. Can we not just accept that people didn’t want to be in the European Union and that’s why they voted to leave it? I may have mentioned a financial journalist who voted to remain purely because of free movement, because his mother lives in the Mediterranean. Were it not for that, he would have voted to leave. He knows a great deal more about it than most people, I would say. In his opinion, most people voted to leave the E.U. because of the way that it treated Greece. You see, there are myriad reasons why people don’t like the E.U. and they didn’t need the likes of Nigel Farage to convince them. Anyway, my point was that on one hand, you had all but called people stupid and on the other, you criticised somebody else, for doing much the same thing yet, you concede that people may have been given bad advice. Which is it?
        Our discourse is toxic, as it is; we must be more careful with our language and respect people’s decisions, even if we disagree with them, instead of insulting them. This is what I oppose. I am not saying that the people were gullible but that that is the word that I would have used, rather than stupid. How many of the people who voted to remain did the slightest bit of research? How many of those people knew what they were voting for and how many of them listened to what the Campaigners told them? It cuts both ways and there were lies coming from that quarter, too and at the time of our entry to the E.E.C. We shouldn’t just use the facts to suit our own preference. People think differently and want different things, it’s as simple as that. Three years on and many people have changed their minds, on both sides. How much more information about the E.U. has entered general discourse? Not a great deal and our politicians are a disgrace, in that regard. We must do better and treat each other with respect.

  1. Zippi

    That is so true but Mainstream Media don’t help by turning ALL of our elections into something that they are not.

  2. Harvey Lloyd

    I agree with most of what you say – but its a little sad that Corbyn seems to have lost the EU plot! But the crucial point is to vote, and at the same time consider very carefully whether you support someone whose christian name is Nigel.

    1. Mike Sivier Post author

      That’s about as deep an argument as any that have been put forward.
      Jeremy Corbyn has NOT lost the plot on the EU. In fact, he probably has a greater grasp of the real issues than anyone else.
      Remember: Brexit will not be affected by anyone taking a seat in the European Parliament after Thursday.

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